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Under what time and circumstance is the use of violence warranted?

The last few days have seen protests at a level of emotion not seen since the BLM protests last summer. In both circumstances, the participants felt they were fighting injustice. What's your take?

Note: please do not consider this question nor any discussion in this thread as inciting violence of any kind or time.

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41 comments (26 - 41)

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2

Lack of consistency, also whats the starting point? Defence of Life, property or sacred ground?

1

I have clearly established lines of demarcation regarding my use of kinetic force. I am comfortable with them because they are well defined and thought out. Unlike others I have the benefit of a lifetime of experience in highly volatile and dangerous environments to draw from.

I will never divulge what my threshold is for violence to anyone. To do so would put me at a disadvantage. It would give anyone with ill will towards me and mine too much information.

1

There are too many rabbit holes on the web for big tech to plug them all. I wonder if replaying the old videos form the McCarthyism witch hunts would reveal near identical behaviors , only it's the left hunting for "sympathizers" now. Their narrow minded ideology makes them likely to repeat history.

1

I'm so glad you asked.

Redline Series, Part 4: Evaluating the Necessity of Political Violence OR How Do I Know When It's Boogaloo Time?

1

In self defense. Outside of that, we can talk about the blood of tyrants and refreshing the tree of liberty and all that but it's not helpful. It's extremely not helpful. We are not living in the 1700s. Violent actions, especially against government, has a very poor track record in history although the birth of the United States is an exception. But that is NOT the world we live in today. The technological changes and the balance of power is so excruciatingly different that it's a non-starter in America. We would all do well to put violence out of our minds as any kind of solution.

Beyond that reality, there is the issue of the American people. We are in this position not only because America has fallen far away from the government of our Constitution, but because so also have the American people. Left AND right. The quixotic prize at the end of the imaginary solution of violence to solve our problems, were such an effort successful (and it will not be) would simply be to change out one group of tyrants for another.

Unfortunately, in the slim chance that America will recover, it will only do so after great pain and oppression far beyond anything we've seen before (outside of black Americans in decades past, not to be confused with SJW whining that we see today in the same terms) and only after people raise a generation of children to value long forgotten American values of liberty. But that chance is slim indeed. We like to think the pendulum swings throughout history, but unfortunately our technology today is very capable of freezing that pendulum in place.

We are in an exceptionally bad spot but violence is not a solution.

1

In the case of the failed coup, they were fighting to preserve white supremacy and patriarchy. I am sure they truly feel that those systems are just and that civil rights are injustice, but that is objectively false.

Sounds like a case of dueling coups.

How is bringing black unemployment to historically low levels preserving "white supremacy"?

@Geofrank There was a trend of decreasing unemployment that began under the Obama administration and continued to record lows, including for Black people, under Trump, before skyrocketing upward this year. Even at its lowest, the Black unemployment rate was double the white unemployment rate. That's an example of white supremacy. But it still has no direct connection to the failed white supremacist coup that happened a couple days ago.

1

Personally never justified, though state violence slavery exploitation and abuse of all kinds must be resisted by non violence, always.

N0DD Level 7 Jan 8, 2021

Slavery was abolished in the US by non-violent means... was it justified?

@Admin slavery has not been abolished.

1

For protection and defence not oppression or destruction.

Tom81 Level 8 Jan 8, 2021

I guess it depends on what type of oppression. BLM rationalized their violence as they claimed to be oppressed. I guess it depends a bit on the availability of alternatives.

1

Police riots are always wrong.

What a great example of hypocrisy - your meme of one of the most repressive police states the world has seen juxtaposed against your comment about police “riots”

My laugh for the day - thanks!

Police units rioting or rioting against the police?

@REN777 The former.

@WilyRickWiles police brutality is indeed a sad reality.

@WilyRickWiles I recently learned that in the US, police officers are allowed to unionise. Could that be a part of the problem?

@Naomi The police unions are definitely part of the problem. They also have de jure and de facto legal privileges. And they are backed up by the business and real estate lobbies of big cities.

@Naomi Those unions have really racist histories, too. In Chicago, Black officers used to have their own union. [en.wikipedia.org]

@WilyRickWiles In the UK, police officers are not allowed to unionise. They take the oath of impartiality, though their higher ups are seen a little woke lately.

@Naomi It has been very difficult to do any real reform at the city level, even under a federal and state mandate. The business and real estate lobbies strongly resist any counterbalance to the police. And at the end of the day, even the Democratic Party favors "law and order." Until racism and sexism have been vanquished in society, that order will be racist, sexist, and favor the political right. And police policy tasks them with controlling any gathering of people in public that is counter to those traditional hierarchies. Hence why police are twice as likely to break up a leftist protest. [fivethirtyeight.com]

@WilyRickWiles I agree with you on the police unions, concerning indeed, they should not have the ability to unionize. Thing is though... you can't blame that one on Republicans as a good percentage of them are opposed to unions, the Democrats are known to support unions. The grab for power is not exclusive to the right or even private businesses, both political extremes back "law and order".

@SpikeTalon Both parties support police unions. The "center-left" to the far right support "law and order."

@WilyRickWiles On the second part, not everyone who would fall under the category of political right support law and order, I'm one of them. The concept of law and order is strictly human made, and is the opposite of voluntaryism. Fascism is known to be more right-leaning than left, but they aren't the only ones occupying the right though.

0

Defending yourself and your family.

0

In defense of your life and property !

0

This is a loaded question for a variety of reasons. My first concern is answering a question like this on a social media platform in the highly surveilled environment we are in.

I will proffer this... I am fully aware of what is going on around me and the world. My perception of what is right and wrong, good and evil, are my own. I am not a joiner. I affiliate with no organization or person. My motivation and mantra are intrinsic, the cumulative result of my life experience.

0

When you are confident you can win and the ends justify the means, or defense.

0

A Christian never does. It's clear how a Christian proceeds.
For the world, when home and hearth and personal safety are extremely threatened, then VIOLENCE will erupt bcuz VIOLENCE is being perpetrated on them, even if it's hidden.
They have little recourse except VIOLENCE which they are then BLAMED for.
But the REAL VIOLENCE was done to them, pushing them hard.
A Christian PRAYS, knows God will act.
It won't be THEIR will, but God's will.
The world do it themselves.
You can see how that's working out.

0

Words never justify violence. Nasty and vile as some are.
The only thing that justifies violence is when you are defending yourself or someone else nearby and there's no peaceful way to resolve it.
If you are a police officer or soldier you are defending the people of your community or country and the same rules apply.

REN777 Level 7 Jan 8, 2021
0

Violence has many sides , violence is neither good nor bad ,,, it’s what is being acted out violently that would be under such judgment. ,,, there would be many reasons , some of which for each would have different ramifications upon execution whether one would agree that it was warranted or not People are the actors, violence is just an action that can’t be blamed for anything

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