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What has been the long-term impact of the #MeToo movement?

It's been almost 3 years since #MeToo, "Believe Women" and the PussyHat movements [en.wikipedia.org] dominated headlines and motivated women to organized against perceived injustices. Harvey Weinstein and Bill Cosby were the smoking gun "proof" that women are widely victimized by men in a similar way that George Floyd's death was "proof" that white police widely victimize black men. Now, like the LGBT-rights movement, the women's movement seem almost forgotten to the BLM and "racial justice" movements. Or has it?

The lasting effect of the #MeToo movement has been to

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15

So you spend 50 years sexualizing women with a sexual revolution and rants of free sex so that men could be heard saying " I can't believe it, the women are giving it away" and tell women that they should pursue sex like men in the workplace (leading to 10's of thousands of divorces )then turn 180 degrees and scream me too.
This is what you call out of the asylum insanity of liberal socialism.

A lot of truth there.

So women trying to gain independence and control of their own bodies means they can't be upset over sexual assault? That's a ludicrous argument.

Who spent 50 years sexualizing women? Women? Feminists? Feminists run the studios, strip clubs, music agencies, and the erotic entertainment industry? Actual feminists of the radical feminist kind are anti-sex work. Hence why they're called "SWERFs" along with "TERFs".

14

What a joke. Alot of outting was done. Some effective (Ailles) and some not. THEN Joe Biden is accused and the accuser was immediately discredited and silenced. Like most leftist movements, totally subjective, played out, then fallen by the wayside. Like kids with a new toy to scream for ... little or nothing has come from this.

Amen...

13

The #MeToo is kind of paradoxical. On one hand they utterly reject codes of gentlemanly manhood as a hopelessly outdated form of male domination. On the other hand they demand gentlemanly restraint from every man they encounter.

At the bottom of this paradox is a rejection of traditional assumptions about human nature and the contradictions this inevitably brings.

I concur.

Who are you referring to? I am a feminist. I had a rock band in the 90s. Wore nose rings. Went to Lilith Faire and never said men shouldn't be gentlemanly. We never said that men have to sign a consent form either.

This is neoliberal feminism sponsored by Everyday Feminism (look it up). Look up who funded it, too.

Howdy @ThomasinaPaine,

I was speaking of #MeToo, not first wave or equity feminism.

I believe the point is valid. #MeToo is demanding moral behavior without the moral values that make it important.

@ThomasinaPaine Ugh! The "Everyday Feminism" website looks like the typical leftist garbage!

I didn't manage to find who funds it, except that they have a Patreon page...

MeToo suffers from a duplicity in goals. On one hand it really went after powerful abusive men in Hollywood and the media, but it also wanted a vendetta against regular men for past sexual conduct even if it was consensual. Women can now rewrite the past and withdraw consent at any time for past sexual encounters. And consent reached weird levels on campus in the late Obama years, like you being playing handsy in the couch alone in a private room has not signaled enough that you have consented to have intimate action (no that you cannot stop at any time, but now you have to ask verbally before every step and sign a form in the state of CA).

On the other hand they confessed from the beginning that they wanted half of the power positions in Hollywood and the media by 2020. Half by 2020 was called. So obviously the plan was to replace Weinstein, Ailes and Co with females. This is easier to do for show hosts and similar positions, but for positions that require a previous reputation like directors or a long career like execs it proved to be more difficult. Anyway the plan is to replace half (to begin with) of the positions that have some prestige with women with quotas and not by making them more competitive. Meritocracy will be dead soon.

@Rad_Millennial Ok... I like nuance! I'll leave it to a self-confessed left-wing, anti-liberal, passionate radical feminist to explain the nuance between liberal and leftist.

I still think "Everyday Feminism" is dangerously radical garbage!

11

The “Me Too” movement is/was simply another Brick in the Wall leading to AntiFa which lead to BLM which will lead to ...?

This is all DemLib/Socialist/MarxoCommunist “Fragmentation” of the Populace.

People seem to think that these are all separate things but they’re not. If you step back and look at the Damage Wrought by Obama and Everything that has followed, they’re ALL pieces of the Same Puzzle coming together.

Ferguson, Baltimore, Boston & the “Beer Summit”, Trayvon Martin ... ALL Directed at “White People BAD” ...
Deplorables, Trump Supporters, Trump is NEVER Gonna Win ... “Orange Man & White People BAD” + “Conservatives BAD” ...
Trump Haters, Never Trumpers, Trump is a RACIST, Trump SUPPORTS Racism ... “Orange Man & White People AND Conservatives BAD” ...
“Me Too & the Pussy Hat Brigade” ... “Orange Man & White People & Men & Conservatives BAD” ...
Trump & the RUSSIANS ... the UKRAINE ... the CHINESE ... “.Orange Man & White People & Men & Conservatives BAD & ANYONE Supporting Orange Man BAD” ...
Corona Virus, Hydroxychloroquine, Masks, Social Distancing, WHO, CDC, Dr. Fauci
“ANYONE Resisting US are BAD”
AntiFa, BLM, “Black Lives Matter”

YOU Will Bow ... YOU Will Kneel ... YOU Will Grovel ... YOU Will BEG OUR FORGIVENESS ... YOU Will PAY REPARATIONS ...

“YOU are ALL GUILTY ... YOU are ALL SINNERS ... YOU are ALL BAD” (Even if WE haven’t found a way to SAY YOU ARE BAD)

Its a “Progressive Movement” as in, Each Piece simply is Progressing to the Next Piece.
Where’s it going to end?

Its looking more and more like when the US Citizenry decides that THIS IS ALL BULLSHIT and a NEW “Joe McCarthy Age” Begins ... and BLOOD Runs in the Streets ... and ALL THESE MISCREANTS get Crushed ...

“Me Too” is just a tiny piece in the puzzle and, frankly means nothing more than yet Another Wedge in a Unified Nation.

Bay0Wulf Level 8 July 23, 2020

Yup. The long march through our country.

10

I wish I could say it was to make the world a safer place for women but it cannot be when you exclude subsets of women with politics you don't like and include "nonbinary" men in lipstick so that you can place their needs above actual women. Somehow wearing a burqa and hajib is "feminist" to the neoliberal feminists who co-opted and ruined intersectionalism.

Instead of this being about actual change it became "we hate everyone who isn't with us and/or votes Trump".

It is disappointing to say the least.

9

The left sexualized women so that they could try to bring down the nuclear family and it worked. The left has championed FREE love for many many decades. It was rampant in pre WWII Germany. IT did not work as well as they would like so now we have them trying to change the natural sexual selection of mates with all the pure LGBTXYZ fantasy and using race as a foil to bait the unsuspecting fish with fake invented social psychology perpetuated by foul self-aggrandizing Red Leftists university professors.

9

If anything, it's lasting effect will be a lot of women living the single life. Unless you're a secure, REAL woman who understands and appreciates a REAL man, good luck finding a mate in the wake of this "movement". It's a movement, alright.....

@Jyvur_Entropy Oh, how I want to take the bait here, but I think I'll pass. 🙂

@Jyvur_Entropy I didn't see that he specifically stated what sort of behaviors represent a "real man." All that was knee-jerk, indoctrinated assumption on your part.

7

It is all about dividing our citizens into small and smaller groups!!! Small groups are easier to manage!!!
Taking the MAN out of the household is another way to make women dependent on the Government!!!

Serg97 Level 8 July 23, 2020
7

It was flawed from the start. It should fail. No one should believe anyone without concrete proof. It certainly is not a constitutional situation therefore it has no place in America.

drptree Level 6 July 23, 2020
7

Impact of #MeToo
—We lost Kevin Spacey and Louis CK
—We were force-fed the Christine Blasey Ford sideshow
—Ronan Farrow scored a massive book deal
—Politicians and C-list actresses got their 15 minutes
—Corporate America spend hundreds of millions on re-education lunch-and-learns
—Everyone went home

GeeMac Level 8 July 23, 2020

Was it more a dress rehearsal for today's protests?

@Admin Good point. Creating a safer world for women and pushing back on racism are extremely important issues and deserve support; but for some far-leftists, #MeToo and BLM are just fronts for something deeper.

7

Like all these movements they suffer from over-reach, being highjacked by nutters, over exposure and generally weponised against people offering an type of critique.

Added to that their demands contain nothing of substance or sane to treat with and add to the general exaustion of the populace. See PJ O rourke for some good takes on this.

7

There are just too many movements for anyone to keep track of. We will have to borrow from Andy Warhol and assign 15 minutes to each one. There is no doubt that women get sexually assaulted and raped in large numbers. There is no excuse for it. But just like the BLM movement it takes responsibility from all parties involved. The black community cannot put all blame on others. There must be hard, effective work within their community. Movements tend to lump the target into one homogeneous group which distorts what needs to be accomplished. Women also have responsibility to recognize situations that hold the potential for danger and take action to neutralize it. If someone says “I have my rights and I should be able to go where I want and do what I want without getting hurt”. they have no reason to expect that. Everybody is better off if they identify dangerous situations and avoid them. “I should have the right to drive as fast as I want to and not get hurt.”

Pand0ro Level 7 July 23, 2020
6

It's a Globalist engineering for the New World Order to destroy relationships with men and women so they don't procreate and continue to have families.

drptree Level 6 July 23, 2020

👍

6

Generally people who complain about the supposed marginalization of their group serve as the most compelling arguments for why they themselves should be marginalized. People who do things like falsely accuse men of rape should be disenfranchised. Why should voting rights be extended to people who have no honor?

5

I voted for the third option, strictly my opinion that option comes closest to the perceived goal of the MeToo movement. Over the last ten or so years there appears to be at least one new group that pops up every year advocating on behalf of progressive causes. From Occupy Wallstreet (and the other Occupy manifestations) to MeToo to BLM now, the progressive crowd has to constantly reinvent itself, as progressive politics are still viewed by many as actually being regressive. In an effort to get the attention of young people and possibly recruit them to their cause(s), the progressives need to constantly come up with new groups that go along with the fads (for lack of a better word there) of the day. Police brutality is the hot topic these days, and the progressives didn't waste any time capitalizing on the situation. MeToo was just another fad movement, now dying a slow agonizing death, and in the years ahead probably won't be missed by many. The last women's rights march (back in January I think) was a flop, attendance at its all time lowest, mostly thanks to accusations of anti-semitism from some of the march's organizers.

4

Meanwhile in the United Kingdom , for decades, the government and police covered up the rape of half a million girls and young women by Asian grooming gangs....... Where is the # me to movement on this, nowhere to be seen

4

It covered up the rampant pedophilia in Hollywood by diverting attention to a bunch of washed up enablers and literal attention whores.

I think you made a typo. Did you mean the rampant pedophilia in the Catholic Church?

@JacksonNought You are blinded by limiting your pedo view to the Catholic Church.

They were just the tip of the proverbial iceberg. The "Church" (plural), Hollywood, the political elite, the 1%ers, international Royalty ... international political elite .... the pool of rampant pedophiles is and has been epidemic worldwide for all of this century, the prior century ... it is Legion. To limit it to the Catholic Church is to be naive.

If Ghislaine Maxwell survives we may begin to see the ugly underpinnings of the real world we naively live in. MeToo is a joke by comparison.

@torontogal4388 I don't doubt it. But the Catholic Church is the largest pedophile conspiracy / ring in the world. I wouldn't call it the tip of the iceberg, I'd say it is its own full iceberg

@torontogal4388 Don't bother engaging the pedopologist. He's distracting from the unseen enemy by pointing to evil already exposed, a red herring. It is not naive but rather purposeful. It is more fruitful to simply describe the methods of his deceit for others as a case study and move on. He will not be moved by any words.

4

Personally, I have a feeling that this is a spiritual war masquerading as a political war.
Half the members of the church of satan are from the “lgbt” “community”.
Soul sucking, man haters unite !!

David42 Level 7 July 23, 2020

The "half of members" statistic was from The Satanic Temple, not the Church of Satan. There's a distinct difference.

And what is wrong with either of them anyhow? Are you anti-American and against freedom of religion?

@JacksonNought I’m anti evil, in any form or fashion.
What is right about them ?
Yes, and if you think any satanic cult is a religion, I’m against it and you.
You probably don’t actually believe in satan, but he believes in you brother, and he has a lake of fire, that you will burn in for eternity, unless you are born again.
And from the looks of things, that right soon.
Read the New Testament, it’s actually amazingly short and simple and easy to read.
It has been enlightening, Billions of fools like you and me, for millennia.

@David42 you are right, I do not believe in Satan. And the US government recognizes The Satanic Temple as a tax-exempt religion. So yeah, I guess you are just anti-American if you wish to remove the freedom of religion from a group because you disagree with them.

I have read the Bible - both the Old and New Testaments. From my perspective, Satan was the good guy.

From The Satanic Temple: "Do you promote evil? No. The Satanic Temple holds to the basic premise that undue suffering is bad, and that which reduces suffering is good. We do not believe in symbolic 'evil.' We acknowledge blasphemy is a legitimate expression of personal independence from counter-productive traditional norms."

@JacksonNought Which sounds better: Church of National Socialism or National Socialist Temple?

Church of Satan/Satanic Temple-- you've got a branding issue there, Jackson.

Weird. I haven't encountered many "man haters" in or outside of the LGBT community. You know what they say about like attracting like.

@ThomasinaPaine well I have no official role in either organization, so it isn't my branding issue. TST and CoS are two completely distinct organizations with different values, leadership, members, etc. It's like comparing Google and Apple because they both make phones. Or I guess better yet, more like Catholics, Baptists, Protestants, Pentecostals, JWs, Mormons, Unification, Unitarian, etc... where's the branding in the Christianity front?

Also nice attempt to label Satanists as Nazis, when the Nazi party was inspired by Christianity.

@JacksonNought you are all evil idiots in my book.

@David42 good for you. Welcome to America - freedom or religion. I think Christianity is nothing but evil idiots, you still get to freely have your religion.

4

Long term impact? A hell of a lot of people no longer believe any accusation unless it comes from somebody we know very personally, and trust to be honest and decent?

govols Level 8 July 23, 2020
3

What it has actually done is make men so wary of women they don’t want to hire them, work with them, or date them.

2

It's a mixed bag. Bill Clinton is still untouchable.

The problem I have is that as long as we have a culture that condones promiscuity the problem isn't really being addressed. The left has long promoted an agenda that promotes primitive instincts so I have little sympathy for their version of the plight of women. While I don't feel humans are naturally monogamous the institution of marriage is a real and important abstraction. It is not designed to serve individuals but to maintain social order. It is another example of how civilization must exchange freedom for security. Simply making women secure from sexual predation doesn't make them secure from the long term consequences of a society that is increasingly chaotic.

The data suggest that while women would like the resources men produce they will opt for as much independence as they can use their political power to gain. That goes beyond unreasonable child support and alimony, the welfare state and it's generosity to single mothers, demands for equal pay without equal work, free access to abortion and birth control. It includes sexual promiscuity without social responsibility. The data also suggests that the cost of single motherhood includes high crime , poor academic performance and generally poorly disciplined children without impulse control. For their independence society bears an unreasonable burden. Girls as it turns out really do just want to have fun.

Sex crimes are among the most difficult to prove. Since the vast majority are committed by men women seem to have adopted the attitude that innocent until proven guilty should not apply. They accept no responsibility for how promiscuity desolved the social structure that made sex crimes much easier to prosecute. The current social paradigm is a fairy tale where long standing social mores that evolved over thousands of years simply can be discarded without unpleasant consequences.

wolfhnd Level 8 July 23, 2020

Um. Rape is JUST as hard to prove in Saudi Arabia. Women there aren't sexually promiscuous or showing off a bit of leg every now and then in Islamic countries. So maybe not draw conclusions about behavior and the legal system. Rape has always been difficult to prove. Even the ancient Romans struggled with it.

@ThomasinaPaine

Saudi Arabia is a different culture with it's own problems.

[jurist.org]

What I'm addressing is the issue of believing women and how that conflicts with the ideal of innocent until proven guilty. But there is the broader issue of how reputation is a social tool to restrain behavior. If a society frowns on promiscuity people are less likely to risk their reputation by placing themselves in situations where they may actually commit assault or be falsely accused of assault. Restraining promiscuity cannot be sexual biased.

Victim shaming however is more complicated than it may feel. For the most part proof is impossible without witnesses in many cases. The problem of his word against her's is nearly insurmountable. Courts can turn to patterns of behavior with multiple victims testifying. When multiple victims are not available the defense will mount it's own pattern of behavior to discount a single victims testimony. Despite the outrage people may feel those cases should probably not be brought to trial unless there is forensic evidence. in any case these cases mostly fall outside of what social censure of promiscuity can effect.

As to promiscuity you assumed I was focused entirely on female behavior and rape. The discussion however started with the me too movement which encompasses more than sexual assault. For example Quid pro quo harassment is illegal under most states and federal law. Males that are committed to a single mate are not only much less likely to commit this crime but also males that are known to be promiscuous will have more trouble mounting a defense.

Even in the case of rape it is primarily a problem with males. If males are socially censured for promiscuity it may have a positive effect on situations such as date rape. It certainly wouldn't eliminate it but it would in my opinion reduce the likelihood.

Admittedly when it was the case that theoretically sex was reserved for marriage all the problems that currently exist existed. Social censure was more theoretical than actual and definitely wasn't applied without bias or exception. When I talk about developed over thousands of years I talking about principles or ideals.

@wolfhnd @ThomasinaPaine Give someone even a little bit of power and there is a high likelihood they will abuse it... whether the power comes from a traditional kind of status or from a "victim" status. It's human nature.

#MeToo has brought some bad men to justice, and it has also had the effect of handing bad women a huge whip.

I think the point about promiscuity is separate from the point about rape being difficult to prove. There are two points raised here:

1. Rape is generally difficult to prove, and the left today is pushing for "men are guilty until proven innocent" and maybe still guilty even then.
2. Promiscuity is one of many factors contributing to the breakdown of society, and is related to heightened tensions between men and women. Heightened tension do not excuse crime by any means, but they do increase the likelihood of it occurring.

@DaveO276

I said sex crimes not rape. Rape is as you say is perhaps primarily but not entirely a separate issue.

The point I want to make is that sex crimes are primarily a male problem. Outside of prostitution the vast majority of offenders are male. To be crude it is a physiological reality that you cannot make a male have sex nor can you make them pregnant. Sure there are plenty of females who engage in Quid pro quo harassment or abuse minors but let's just leave that aside. If for no other reason than the risk of pregnancy makes sex more dangerous for females. Risk of pregnancy creates a natural damper on female promiscuity, at least it did before the pill.

The reason that sexual mores didn't work in the past was the lack of social censure of males by males. Obviously female promiscuity will mostly disappear without willing male partners. Female sexual assault being extremely rare it is hardly a concern.

These opinions have made me the object of ridicule speaking directly to how little concern most people have for sexual morality. I'm not religious so people assume I must be mad or in someway incompetent. I just don't see the world as a matter of individual existence. As social animals we are defined by our relationship to society. Not to mention that the advantages in subduing ego out weigh the disadvantages. Many people may have discovered the basic principle through meditation but do not apply it to other aspects of life. As it applies here do people have sex or does sex control people.

@wolfhnd It is a physiological reality that you cannot make a male pregnant, yes. You can demand he pay child support for a child he didn't want...

And it is entirely possible (though, perhaps difficult) to force a male to have sex - even as the penetrator. Erection is an involuntary reaction to certain kinds of stimulus, and does not equal consent. The same goes for ejaculation, even though a man can train himself to exercise some control over that.

@wolfhnd But not all feminists are pro-promiscuity. Radical feminists, conservative feminists, gc feminists are all ANTI promiscuity. You are speaking of neoliberal feminism like Emma Watson, Alyssa Milano, and Amber Heard.

@wolfhnd What makes you think "Female sexual assault being extremely rare it is hardly a concern." Evidence please.

@ThomasinaPaine

Sure, you can't lump people into one basket. I apologize for the confusing post.

I may try to clarify latter. The problem is that sexuality is intricately tied to so many behavioral patterns in a sexually reproducing species. I have tried to have this conversation before and have been meet with little interest in starting at the beginning where all good analysis must. To formulate an answer you first have to examine what is immutable about male and female sexuality. Unfortunately we have an intellectual community that has adopted a social constructionist position. Without understanding the nature of the instincts behind sexuality you will have trouble untangling how instinct and culture coevolved.

@Thasaidon

Here you go.

[theatlantic.com]

I tend not to trust any data these days without a deep dive but you have to start somewhere.

What no study I know of addresses is that if you include verbal and emotional abuse females are a large part of the problem but you can't take a thread in a thousand different directions. Trying to keep on the topic of the me too movement is already proving difficult for me.

@wolfhnd A study into "verbal and emotional abuse by females" is one I would welcome. I was in married and my ex wife was very verbally and emotionally abusive. We had children so felt I had to stay for their sake. It is only recently that I started to realise just how abusive she was. Thanks MGTOW.

@Thasaidon

My theory is that hypergamy extends past social status and material resources. Even if serial monogamy is real, as in being an instinctual predisposition, most animals that mate for life are surprisingly sexually unfaithful. It makes sense for females to be able to capture the resources of reliable males to help raise offspring while being fertilized by genetically superior males. The hen pecking and non stop complaining females engage in is just not a product of Neuroticism as a personality trait (subject to strong negative emotions). The two year itch sets in about the time of natural weaning. The female is then free to engage other males as she no longer is as dependent. To do so she needs to drive her existing mate off without invoking a violent response. Nothing would do that better than almost undetectable but persistent nagging. You see the same cryptic abuse in other apes where higher status females pluck the hair of the lower status females offspring. What can't be had by overt violence can be achieved through emotional manipulation.

BTW I'm not a fan of MGTOW beyond recognizing that the current social paradigm leaves many men abused both by their spouses and society at large. That said feminism and the promotion of single motherhood has proven to be less than ideal for children. I have no idea what the solution is but would prefer that the institution of marriage be preserved.

1

I was talking to a friend about the #MeToo thing (witch hunt). He said he thought it was worth it to convict fifty innocent men to get to one bad one. I disagreed, I said that is not justice that's war. And when you engage in indiscriminate war tactics the other side is eventually going to return in like.

I have seen this first hand when the other side returns the war like tactics that are crushing and devastating.

1

we have taken active measures in our business environment to vet hires as people who build things rather than people who destroy... its a unique skill set considering how we have trained kids in school to call everything out. if we believe one iota that a candidate has a record of calling out those above them in order to increase his/her status within their former organization rather than by building their own body of work, or possess any personality traits to suggest this, that candidate will not be considered.... the danger of toxicity is too great.

this exists independently outside of the LGTBQ movement or the BLM movement but is a commonality both. using the word Equity instead of equality is a dead giveaway

RobD1 Level 7 July 24, 2020
1

Made women look unreasonable, Again.

1

The MeToo movement was the blueprint used by BLM to start taking down anyone in their way. MeToo ran out of gas due to the overreach of it's evangelists. The highly public examples of 'offenders', as in the case of Supreme Court Justice Kavanough, during the confirmation hearing was the hill the movement chose to die on. In the end, BLM's use of the strategy will find a hill to die on too. When the public has had enough, they will push back with extreme prejudice taking no prisoners, proverbially speaking of course. Look for the money to drain out of the high profile business that thought it was their duty to MeToo innocent people (whites for the most part). I've already started taking my money out of businesses that support the movement. Quit watching cable news of any kind, or attending sporting events or buying products from other national companies. They will feel it in the next quarterly reporting and they will change their tune. The thing is, that strategy will only work by continuing with 'No Buy Zones' until they are brought down financially.

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