Getting stuff done vs Principles
Greetings ladies and gentlemen.
I want to bring up an issue to which I find to be a bit disturbing to me in regards to some slight trends in both conservative and libertarian circles.
The concern is that some individuals think this is okay while some perceive this as overreach. By constitutional standards which of these is correct?
I want this discussion to focus mainly on the constitutionality of declaring a National Emergency and wether or not some of these Republicans (Specifically Rand Paul and Mike Lee) are in right or in the wrong. Some of them laid out their arguements. I also would like this to be a philosophical discussion on whether or not getting stuff done can be used as an excuse to violate certain standards vs keep those that serve us accountable based on standards of merit no matter who they are even if we idolize them. Agreements and disagreements are welcome but please do be constructive respectful in your answers.
As some of you may be aware, 12 Republicans including Rand Paul and Mike Lee voted against the National Emergency Declaration that the President Trump declared.
According to Rand Paul, he gives his arguement based on his constitutional constructionist principles: [paul.senate.gov]
As a result, Rand Paul is being labled as a RINO despite his track record here: [thenewamerican.com]
According to the Constitution, the power of the purse is vested in the Congress as laid down in the Constitution of the United States, Article I, Section 9, Clause 7 (the Appropriations Clause) and Article I, Section 8, Clause 1 (the Taxing and Spending Clause)
To compare, this is the National Emergency Act of 1976: [en.wikipedia.org]
Keeping this in mind is the President stepping out of bounds? Consider this question carefully.
You may be asking, what makes this declaration any different from past ones?
On a side note from wikipedia: Trump’s declaration was unprecedented in that none of the 58 previous emergency declarations made by the American executive branch involved circumventing Congress to spend money it had expressly refused to authorize or allocate.
What do you all think of this?
Do you consider this overreach? Is this justified? If so, how?
Please give your thoughts.
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4 comments
Feel free to reply to any comment by clicking the "Reply" button.What a complete mess.
First, this resolution passed by the Senate is specific to Trump's emergency declaration. If you have a problem with the Emergency declaration powers, then you need to rescind those specific emergency powers that our legislature abdicated to the president. We need this door shut for all time and not just for this situation.
Second, the legislature has and continues to abdicate its legislative responsibility. This is an even bigger problem than the problem on our border. They need to return to regular order on budget bills. The fillibuster rules need to be reinstated (no moving forward until the fillbuster is done - you can delay but not stop a vote).
Third, the border issue is a winning issue, politically and is necessary physically. But because of this Emergency Powers distraction, we aren't talking about it. Hang the wall around the leftists' necks. No border no country.
RobBlair
Level 8
Mar 15, 2019
0
Can't say I agree with President Trump's method in regards to the border wall, and that may very well be overreach on his part. It's a shame insults had to be added into the equation, just because Rand Paul disagreed doesn't automatically make him a RINO, and I commend him for standing up for what he believes in. All in all I do believe there is an immediate crisis at the southern border and something does need to be done about it, just not sure if a wall will solve all the problems or not?
SpikeTalon
Level 10
Mar 15, 2019
1
Agreed. I am ashamed that some people are insulting Rand Paul. Which brings me to another concern.
I notice that supporters of Trump tend to disagree with anyone who opposes him. This is strikingly similar to how the left treats those that disagree with them. Not all are like this.
Whether we know this or not, I fear that we patriots are not setting a good example in terms of showing merit and realistic standards of debate and disagreements. Don't get me wrong. I think we have done some drastic improvements on showing realistic conduct of approaching things. We just need to remind ourselves to remember our place. Especially since most people in this country got a wake up call when Trump campaigned for the presidency. I think if we want to show people that we can make a difference, we ought to have the responsibility of applying smart behavioral standards to ourselves. We must avoid creating double standards by accident that don't make sense and fall on the left's level of immature behavior.
One thing I've learned is that human nature does not care about our beliefs and outlooks on various subjects in politics. We humans should start improving our minds better and control our urges.
We are by no means perfect but can learn from our mistakes.
I am from California and I also agree that the southern border is in a state of crisis and full of disaster that can't be ignored.
@E-E-E Keen observations there. No shortage of hypocrisy from both sides of the aisle, which is why I tend to favor the Libertarian point of view...
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